Seems quiet, so a Homelite saga update

[davriker]

Hey all, been busy moving and building a house, so boat got very little attention this year.

I noticed a very significant drop in power early this year, finally checked compression and had a dead #1 (bottom cylinder). Pulled the powerhead and shipped back to Ed since I only had about 60 hours on it. He changed some valve shims and got the compression back.

Still an odd misfire, mostly after a minute of run time. I get full power, then a loss of about 10%....
Confirmed no problem with fuel delivery.
Changed coil and plugs. A little better
Found loose ground wire to distributor, replaced the stripped screw... a little better
Swapped out distributor for NOS unit with brand new points and condenser to see if problem might be the petronix unit, no change.
Returned to the previous distributor and back to the petronix unit, replaced wires and checked plugs. Found one plug was defective, and replaced it. Better but still a random miss. Full power will come and go...
Found a loose wire in the control box, and was sure this was it. Full power for almost 4 minutes, then, on again off again. At this point, I burnt out the starter from too much cranking in too short a period of time (I had accidentally reversed plug wire 3 and 4 during the wire replacement step, and took a while and too much cranking to figure out that rookie mistake.
I've found a used starter, and it's on the way. I have another cap and rotor to try, but don't think that's it, but I'll be damned if I can figure this out....
as a P.S. been looking at alternative starters in the event I need one. Rewinding the armature is about $150, Ed wants over $300 for a rebuilt. Is there a Prestolite or Evenrude Johnson, or Force substitute cause from the pictures, they look close??...

[John Nelson]

You should be able to have it rebuilt anywhere that rebuilds starters its all standard parts. Ed sells brushes. Those starters get corrosion between its parts and gives itself a bad ground. Did someone put carbon core plug wires on that motor?

[davriker]

I had copper core wires on until Sunday, I just changed to carbon core because I was told that the copper core wires create interference with the Petronix unit,but there was no change either way. But I think I had an epiphany last night. When I sent the short block to Ed, he repainted it. The ground cable from the battery connects to the starter, and the starter bolts transfer that ground to the block. So the next thing I'm going to do is clean all the paint away where the starter bolts to the block and see if that solves it. I just have a hunch I'm chasing bad ground.

[Helmar]

I had copper core wires on until Sunday, I just changed to carbon core because I was told that the copper core wires create interference with the Petronix unit,but there was no change either way. But I think I had an epiphany last night. When I sent the short block to Ed, he repainted it. The ground cable from the battery connects to the starter, and the starter bolts transfer that ground to the block. So the next thing I'm going to do is clean all the paint away where the starter bolts to the block and see if that solves it. I just have a hunch I'm chasing bad ground.

Yes on the starter, any starter, alt, generator shop can go though them. Most of the time the terminal that holds the brushes will get hot and come loose.
I have gone as far as drilling down in the bottom of the bolt, thread it and use another bolt and washer to hold the brushes back in place.
Come to think of it, this might not have what I did that on ??? Getting old and well, the CRS is getting worse.

Anyway, the starters are not hard to fix, Brush's and Bushings for the most part.

So, tell me more about the drop in power after warm? Any louder ticking like the valve hanging up or missing ?
Any spitting or funny sound coming from either one of the carburetors ?
I would get a warm compression test on it myself.

I learned the Hard way, the Coil needs to match the pico farads of the condenser.
Long story made short, I fought a lugging problem and all time it was the coil and condenser did not match so full power, not enough to kick the coil hard enough to fire hot enough. The coil being a transformer, you need to kick it pretty good to make it fire.
Thanks to John Nelson, I went and got a coil and condenser for a early Ford so they matched. I had to modify my coil holder to hold the newer coil was all. Starting problem went away.

I have also found that I am getting lazy and not checking the easy stuff.
Super Sporter and I went though the top end of mine thinking I had a intake valve open as she was spitting just ever so slightly in the carb.
Everything checked out more than within spec's.
What I found was, the top of my distributor was Loose and she would advance herself so much that she would start lugging down. It got back enough she would not come up on plain so back to the engine and started monkeying around with the timing. Nothing I did made much difference.
I had timed it before in the water barrel and it seemed fine.
Anyway, the good wife was at the helm and I was messing with the distributor and then after I was baffled, I grabbed the upper part and twisted it and I will be damned, it was Loose. Never the less, I retarded it some and the damn thing jumped up on plain like a cut cat. Almost though me out the back of the boat.
Now, I try to check and double check for the stupid things.
Like I can't get full throttle only to find out, my controls messed up. A friend of mine walked up to the engine and pulled the throttle cable off and was able to push the throttle shaft on the carb up a Bunch. Problem solved again.

Here is a little item I am not sure how I was able to get along without it.
They call it a Endoscope. Its $20 bucks on Amazon.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

This thing works WIFI to a smart phone or tablet of your choice.
It even comes with a little mirror that you can slip on the end and small enough you can stick it in even a Small Honda motor spark plug hole.
With that little critter, I could look into each spark plug hole with the little mirror attachment and even look for possible burnt or sticking valves.

So, the more information you come up with the better.
To fall back 10%, something is breaking down or sticking.

Helmar

[John Nelson]

I think they will run on one carb ? Try running on one then the other see if the problem is in one. You might have a partial blockage between the fuel inlet and the needle and seat. I fantasied about fitting mine with a big mercury starter but it required making a custom ring gear. I asked Blanchard electric if there was anything I could bot in place of the prestolite and they said NO.

[davriker]

Haven't checked in in a while, and realized I never really posted the final diagnosis and fix. It was a three fold problem with each one contributing to the symptom. Short answer, two bad spark plugs. Why? Running too lean at full throttle just before it would die out. Why... because the fuel pump was unable to pull the fuel from where I had mounted the tanks. It was too far of a run. Why didn't I figure that out? Because the bottom carb had a crack where the main jet seat screws in, which let that carb flood at idle low RPM. Moved the fuel pump up by the tanks, replaced the fuel bowl on the bottom carburetor, replaced the spark plugs. Running like new .

[Helmar]

Haven't checked in in a while, and realized I never really posted the final diagnosis and fix. It was a three fold problem with each one contributing to the symptom. Short answer, two bad spark plugs. Why? Running too lean at full throttle just before it would die out. Why... because the fuel pump was unable to pull the fuel from where I had mounted the tanks. It was too far of a run. Why didn't I figure that out? Because the bottom carb had a crack where the main jet seat screws in, which let that carb flood at idle low RPM. Moved the fuel pump up by the tanks, replaced the fuel bowl on the bottom carburetor, replaced the spark plugs. Running like new .

Good Find !.
I too will go looking for One issue but tend to find that its One issue that is causing several other issues that need to be looked at and fixed as well.

Glad you got it. Once those things are running right, its a killer little engine to have.

In fact, I am keeping one and its going on my little Bell Boy I am restoring

Helmar